Mr. Kunza Speaks #02: The American Third Position, History, Leadership, and Positions & Policies

Download the Podcast:

Mr. Kunza Speaks #02 (Part 1)
Mr. Kunza Speaks #02 (Part 2)

Had to cut up the file the show. For hosting reasons.

Sorry it took so long to do this show. It is a topic that I did not want to take lightly.


Podcats Notes:

A3P Website: http://american3rdposition.com/
Southern Poverty Law Center website: www.splcenter.org/

The SPLC page on the A3P: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/groups/american-third-position

And the page on Jamie (James) Kelso: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/profiles/jamie-kelso

Image placed by Anonymous on the A3P's website:

Copy of Hacked A3P Emails: http://indianaantifa.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/a3phackfrontpagetext.odt

Video of Kelso at CPAC

A Rough Transcription of the Podcast:

Hello Again and welcome once more to Mr. Kunza Speaks.

For this podcast I will be covering the American Third Position in some detail. I will cover a little History of the party its founding and notable events. Then take a look at the party's Leadership, last I will review the  Positions & Policies of the Party.

Before we begin a little disclaimer. I want to make it clear that American Third Position Party or A3P as they like to call themselves is a hate group according the Southern Poverty Law Center and by the Anti-Defamation League.


If you are not interested in hearing about a hate group, I will not fault you for skipping over this podcast.

I also want to make it clear that this podcast is by no means an endorsement of the Party or its ideas. The same can be said for anyone and any party I cover. The goal of this podcast is to be informative, skeptical, and objective.

I try to find the best evidence for my Podcats and will point out any bad information and lies stated by any party or person.   

Yet I am only human. I can be influenced by own personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing information. Especially when it comes to a group like the A3P.

Alright with that said lets take a look at the A3P's history.  

The 2012 election is the first time that party has ever ran anyone for any office. The only office that they are running for as of this podcast is the President. Which does make some sense seeing as the A3P is not even three years old yet.

There are conflicting reports as to the official date that A3P came to be. The dates range from October 2009 to January 2010. According to the A3P's website they 'launched' on January 01, 2010. 

However, the history of the A3P goes a few months further back. Not too far back, just to May 2009. In that month Freedom 14 a noted California base white power group founded the Golden State Party. A white nationalist political party. 

Freedom 14, primarily organized the party via the website Stormfront.org. For those that are not familiar with Stormfront. According to USA Today it is the most visited white supremacist site on the net. It is the go to website for discussion and information for any Neo-Nazi, white supremacist, etc.

The Golden State Party can be seen as American Third Position 1.0. As most the Golden State Party's platforms and policies have been adopted almost word for word by the A3P.

Almost as quickly as the Golden State Party started it fell apart. On  Sept. 4, 2009 Tyler Cole the chairman of the party was discovered by Jaimee Lynn Fletcher of the Orange County Register to be a two-time felon. The chairman was "convicted of assault with a deadly weapon in 2001 in Arizona and sentenced to a year in prison, court records show. Also, he was convicted in 2008 in Orange County of possession of an illegal machete, possession of marijuana and resisting arrest."

The barely months old party did not survive long after. Either because the fall out was to great for the party or that it was just easier to start over. It happened so soon after their found that they probably didn't even have their pens and letterheads yet.

What happened next has been neatly summed up by the Southern Poverty Law Center:

"On Oct. 15, 2009,  [Freedom 14 members] held a meeting to form a party with a new name and new leadership. They elected racist corporate lawyer William Daniel Johnson as chairman of the newly renamed political party, American Third Position. Johnson had been advocating for the deportation of all non-white immigrants and U.S. citizens, including anyone with any “ascertainable trace of Negro blood,” since 1985, when he wrote a book arguing for a constitutional amendment to do just that. Johnson promoted his book far and wide, including at the 1986 Aryan Nations World Congress."

Moreover the Southern Poverty Law Center stated the following:

"On June 27, 2010, the group absorbed the League of American Patriots, a New Jersey-based group. The league is best known for passing out racist fliers and requiring its members to be heterosexuals of “complete European Christian ancestry.” The merging of the two groups advanced the A3P’s goal of developing active chapters throughout the United States."

Since that time the A3P leadership has evolved to be a whose who of racists. To understand the A3P it very important to look at who is running the party. As the party itself puts out an very lax racist front. This maybe to have some sibilance of respectability. However, one does not have dig very deep to see the deep rooted antisemitism and racial hate at the party's core. The A3P has a total of eight directors and a chairman at the time of this podcast. 

William D. Johnson, Chairman. He is an attorney and noted white supremacist activist.

Kevin B. MacDonald, Director. He is a professor of psychology at California State University, Long Beach. At the time of this Podcast he is still on staff, likely a product of tenor.

He is best known for a theory called "group evolutionary strategy." He put forth the theory in series of books called The Culture of Critique. MacDonald claims that Jews have eugenically evolved to enhance their ability to conspire to out-compete non-Jews for resources while undermining the power and self-confidence of the white majorities in Europe and America whom he insists Jews seek to disposes.


I have not read much of MacDonald's work. I did take a look at 'A People That Shall Dwell Alone: Judaism As a Group Evolutionary Strategy.' In that book it appeared that MacDonald thinks that their is some short of 'Jewish hive mind.' Where each and every Jew follows whatever the hive mind decides for them. I do not want to spend too much time on this theory. After all this is a podcast on the A3P not MacDonald. 


However, MacDonald's theory is pseudoscience. Eugen Schoenfeld, Professor Emeritus of Sociology at Georgia State University, stated "[The theory] is controversial, not only because of its theoretical approach, but also, and perhaps primarily, because of sloppy scholarship. [Macdonald] selects historical incidents that can be used to support his thesis and conveniently omits others that challenge his thesis." 


Moreover in a Slate Magazine article "How To Deal With Fringe Academics". MacDonald's theory has never been peer-review. Steven Pinker of Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences MIT said the following of MacDonald and this theory. 


"MacDonald's main axioms - group selection of behavioral adaptations, and behaviorally relevant genetic cohesiveness of ethnic groups -- are opposed by powerful bodies of data and theory, which Tooby, Cosmides, and many other evolutionary psychologists have written about in detail. Of course any assumption can be questioned, but there are no signs that MacDonald has taken on the burden of proof of showing that the majority view is wrong. The argument, as presented in the summaries, fail two basic tests of scientific credibility: a control group (in this case, other minority ethnic groups), and a comparison with alternative hypotheses (such as Thomas Sowell's convincing analysis of "middlemen minorities" such as the Jews, presented in his magisterial study of migration, race, conquest, and culture)."   

Basically MacDonald theory is junk science.  


James Edwards, Director. James Edwards (No relations to former Presidential candidate John Edwards) is described by the Southern Poverty Law Center as a rising star of the white-nationalist movement. He has a radio show entitled 'The Political Cesspool'. It appears to be broadcasted on only one terrestrial  radio station WMQM 1600AM in Memphis, Tennessee a Christian radio station. Also, It has a stream and podcast. The show is a promotion of anti-semitic, white nationalist and white supremacist views.

Tom Sunic, Director. Tom Sunic or Tomislav Sunić. Is a fascist thinker. He has been involved with Nouvelle Droite or New Right movement and is said to be of the Groupement de recherche et d'études pour la civilisation européenne school of thought. He has held diplomatic positions with the Croatian government and has taught at California State University, the University of California, Juniata College in Pennsylvania, and the Anglo-American College in Prague. He has a steaming radio show "The Sunic Journal," on Voice of Reason. He anti-Semitic and has stated that Jewish influence threatens America's European heritage. Also he thinks fascism is awesome.

Virginia Deane Abernethy, Director. She is also the vice presidential candidate for the party. I will go into more detail on her when I cover the Presidential candidates of the party. For right now all I will say about her is that she is a retired professor that speaks out against immigration.

Dr. Adrian Krieg, Director. The Good Doctor is Swiss born and holds a Cultural doctorate in Manufacturing Science from the World University. The World University is a  distance learning school that dedicated to education in what politely can be called 'New Age' subjects. Dr. Krieg is the Co-Chair Political Science Department World University Roundtable. Which is a odd position for an anti-semitic to hold. Since the World University states that they are a an organization whose goal is "To fulfill the needs and aspirations of men and women of goodwill, of whatever age, nationality, or culture." It is claimed that Dr. Krieg hold many U.S. Patents. The Doctor believes that 9/11 was a false flag opertaion and he makes the following claim "The litigious nature of American society is in fact not American at all but is a Jewish trait." Along with many other anti-semitic statements. And to top it off he is on the editorial board of The Nationalist Times which is the paper of choice fascists and anti-Semites.

Don Wassall, Director. He is the founder and main editor of the Nationalist Times. He is also the Executive Director of the American Nationalist Union and is the administrator of ANU.org, ANU News.net, and Caste Football.us. The American Nationalist Union is a nationalist political organization. ANU is not necessarily fascist but it is white supremacist group and supports many conspiracy theories. While Caste Football tries to to the same with its 'reports' on pro-sports.

Alexander Carmichael, Director. He is the groups lawyer outside of that all I could inf was what i believe is his firms website www.carmichaellaw.org which is very mundane.

Last but not lest is James Kelso, Director. I greatly enjoyed what the Southern Poverty Law Center says about James or Jamie Kelso "Jamie Kelso is an extremely hyper organizer and serial joiner of religious sects and, starting in the 1990s, racist organizations." Jamie Kelso has had a very unique past. It reads like fiction.  He was a member of the “Sea Organization and ran away from them. Then he "John Birch Society (JBS), a conspiracy-minded outfit that has been around for decades and is perhaps best known for accusing President Eisenhower of being a secret communist." Kelso became a moderator for Stromfront.org and is credited with turning Stromfront.org into the site that it is today. He has his own radio show "The Jamie Kelso Show,” which runs on the Voice of Reason Broadcast Network. he has been involved in many  neo-Nazi and white power groups before he joined the A3P. Moreover he has his own news site White News Now. 

I am leaving a lot out when it comes to Mr. Kelso. For anyone that wants to read up on him check out the Southern Poverty Law Center's Intelligence Files on him.

Mr. Kelso is a key figure in the A3P's short history. It is in his role as the A3P's webmaster that the lead to, what is more than fair to say, most public event in the A3P's history. On February 1st 2012 the A3P's official website was attacked by individuals affiliated with the group Anonymous. 

The website was defaced, the website was replaced with an image of the soviet flag and saluting blue pony with a rainbow main. The full image can be seen on the notes for this podcast. While the image was notable it was the text across the top of the image that was of the most significance. A sentence of white text stating the following: "Jamie Kelso and American Third Position Hacked and Destroyed; Private Emails Expose Blatant Racism and Ties to Ron Paul"

It is those supposedly exposed ties to Ron Paul that made the most news. Anonymous leaked many emails from Mr. Kelso,  Merlin Miller the A3P pestilential candidate, and others. There is 86 pages of emails for those that wish to read it all that can be found in the notes of the Podcast. I have read though most of them and if they are fake a lot of work has gone into them. 

Most of the Emails are by Mr. Kelso. Many of the speak to his goals with the website that he runs "Whitenewsnow.com". Mainly how important it is to get the site ranking up and how the site tries to be a tool to recruit people into white nationalism. What becomes clear in email after email is how whitenewsnow is a tool for Kelso to get members of the A3P. AS the following quote from a email by Kelso indicates. "WhiteNewsNow Mods and Members will be joining us, and joining A3P as they get the word."

In emails form Merlin Miller the A3P pestilential candidate. In a email it revealed that the A3P position platform was developed in conjunction with The Nationalist Times. Also, it appears that Miller was trying to court many of Ron Paul supporters to his campaign. 

Moreover, many of the emails speak about Ron Paul and how Mr. Kelso was going to meet him or had a phone call with him. But it is never clear if such a thing actually happened and if it did the what happened and what discussed. In fact one email speaks to how Kelso going to Conservative Political Action Conference or CPAC. A Tea Party sponsored meeting and how Kelso was going to promote the party and while he was there Kelso was going to "be meeting with Congressman Ron Paul and his son Senator Rand Paul personally there on all three days." I could find no evidence that this happened in fact I found a video that shows that things went very bad for Kelso while he was at the conference. He was asked to remove his "Campaign for Liberty" Ron Paul button which he does and then Kelso leaves the hotel alone with his bags in hand.

Alright so what does this have to do with the A3P. It is not clear if anyone form the A3P ever met with Ron Paul or had any real contact with him. Those claiming some ties to an organizer for Ron Paul appear to have sent some emails to Mr. Kelso or got emails from him. Outside of that there is little to tie the A3P to Ron Paul.

That puts us up to day with the A3P. Not much of note has happened since the Anonymous hacking. The Party is now is full campaign mode for the presidency. Which leads us nicely into the platforms of the A3P.

The A3P has a 10 point platform. I have used their own official website as the source for this information.  

"Crime. Taking back our communities."

"Our country has become unrecognizingly dangerous...  Our people (I assume that they mean white people) have had to alter their everyday behaviors to simply keep from being victimized by predators roaming the streets. While the ruling elites drone on endlessly about the rights of criminals, the happiness and welfare of our people has been sacrificed at the altar of political correctness."

"We will put these common sense principles into practice without delay: Enable police to concentrate on real criminals and serve the public welfare, not the political goals of the ruling elite. Permit victims of crime greater freedom to defend themselves and their property. Introduce automatic sentences for repeat offenders who prey on our communities. Support states rights to enforce capital punishment for those convicted of capital crimes. Make prisoners understand that they are being punished, and not rewarded with a state-subsidized vacation for their crimes; in part through wide-scale obligatory public-works projects."

Based on those statements it is more than fair to say that the A3P believes that America has become unrecognizingly dangerous and that predators are roaming the streets.  This is an unfounded statement and it sounds a lot like the plot to the movie Robocop.

Yes there are some places that can be called dangerous in America. However, the the fact is America's crime rate has been falling across the board. Even in a economic downturn crime is still falling.

I do not know who these people are that are droning endlessly on about the rights of criminals. Nor do they make clear of whom they are speaking of.

What is clear is that A3P believes in the right to self-defense. I can only guess that this means that they are supporters of gun rights. One odd statement they make is the following: "Permit victims of crime greater freedom to defend themselves and their property." Which sounds like they believe that a person can only defend themselves and property after they have become a victim. I do not think that this is their intent.

A3P wants automatic sentences for repeat offenders, I think that this means they want something along the lies of the Three Strikes Laws. Also, they support the death penalty and state that jail is a vacation. They support the use of prison labor for public works. Which is something that differentiates them from most political parties.     

It is fair to say that A3P is a law and order party.

On to their next position again this is quoted right off their website with some mild trimming on my part:

"Economy:

The American Third Position supports a nationalist economic policy emphasizing ethical business practices and prioritization of the community. A3P supports “fair trade” as opposed to the so-called “free trade” policies... This can be accomplished through tariffs and quotas at home along with diplomatic pressure abroad. Under this America first system, we would also withdraw from NAFTA, GATT, and the WTO.

Current tax policies often dis-incentivize invention and entrepreneurship. Tax dollars are aggressively collected from our people and funneled to so-called minorities, criminals, and persons unwilling to work. We will cut all programs that provide an incentive for people to be anything other than hard-working and productive.

The Federal Reserve – a central bank made up of privately-owned member banks – loans money to our government at interest. Commercial banks also create money through lending to businesses and citizens. Both practices involve creating money out of thin air. To restore ownership of the American economy to its rightful owners, we will abolish the Federal Reserve, incorporating it into the United States Treasury. We will then grant government the sole right to print, issue and regulate money. Accordingly, the entire banking system would be subject to appropriate ethical constraints."

For anyone that is familiar with right wing or libertarian economic positions will  find nothing unique in the A3P positions. However, they say the following "Tax dollars are aggressively collected from our people and funneled to so-called minorities, criminals, and persons unwilling to work." Of what the referring to is hard to say. There is Tax Incentives for Using a Minority-Owned Business. Or it could be an statement against welware programs. It is not really clear.

Now for their views on Education:

"Education. Not Indoctrination.

The same schools that once taught our children the knowledge, skills, culture, and traditions necessary to maintain and enhance our nation are now controlled by social Marxists....

We support measures to restore our school system to its first rate status. Teachers must emphasize traditional mathematics and literacy skills which have practical application to everyday life. A full curriculum of American history must also be taught....  Organized classrooms settings and well-disciplined learning environments must become the norm once again. We also support greater opportunities for home-schooling arrangements.

Critically, we would introduce a compulsory Community Service system after the student completes their schooling – whenever that may be – to instill in them a work ethic, discipline, and social and community values. Projects would consist of caring for the elderly and handicapped, environmental and heritage restoration projects, or military training.

Service in this system would entitle each individual to get something back from the society to which they have learnt to contribute, such as subsidized university education or apprenticeship, and/or business training and start-up capital for would-be entrepreneurs."

I looked up the word social Marxists and found the following on the Urban Dictionary:  "A social Marxist is someone who half heartidly believes in the Marxist school of political though. They may be anti capitalist, anti war and anti racism, but wont join up a Marxist movement and are more like armchair generals of the far left persuasion. Left wing forums are rife with social Marxists. Some social Marxists simply buy CCCP flags, shirts and hats and have a faint idea what its about, but have no foundations for their ideology"

I do not think that this is what the A3P is referring to. Even though it was the only place that I could find a definition of the term. But maybe it is. Either way it is an odd statement. It should go without say that evidence of this Marxist hold on education is non-existent.

Outside of that statement there is not much of anything unique to found in there education position. The A3P supporting home schooling and believes in  compulsory Community Service for students. The latter policy is unique when compared to the major parties.

As for their views on the Environment:

"Environment. Taking responsibility.

The American Third Position is committed to a beautiful, clean and healthy nation. We are this country’s only true Green party with policies that will actually save the environment. Overpopulation, fueled by massive Third World immigration, is a major cause of the destruction to our environment.

Many Americans recognize the serious trouble associated with dependency on oil from abroad. We must diligently explore and develop cleaner energy sources such as solar, wind and biomass. In keeping with our free enterprise system, individuals, businesses and industry should be encouraged to tap into these abundant non-polluting sources."

Immigrates cause the destruction of the environment. To be frank I have never heard that claim before. Thus I did some research and found the following by Scientific American:

"The non-profit Pew Research Center reports that 82 percent of U.S. population growth is attributable to immigration...

Americans, consumption habits, are fundamental to U.S. environmental problems than population pressures. With just five percent of the world’s people, Americans use a quarter of the world’s fossil fuels, own more private cars than drivers with licenses, and live in homes that are on average 38 percent larger today than they were in 1975. By scaling back, Americans can take a big bite out of pollution, sprawl and other environmental problems, while also setting a good example for those who land in the U.S. every year, lowering the nation’s collective carbon footprint significantly in the process."

Furthermore, if population densities is any indicator American is at no risk of overpopulation.

Anyway, their environmental views for the most part fall in line with what Democrats often argue. Not the overpopulation or immigration part but the invest in alternatives and cut the dependency on oil.

Carrying on the A3P quote: "rejects homosexuality and all of the other types of so-called “alternative lifestyles”." I have not a clue what "alternative lifestyles" they are referencing and what they would do to those people and homosexuals if elected. Their stance is nothing new for anyone who is familiar with right wing politics.

The A3P's Foreign Policy can neatly be summed up as non-interventionist. Furthermore they state they following. "We must withdraw from the United Nations and NATO and close most of the hundreds of overseas military bases. At the same time, we must maintain a strong military for legitimate defense, such as better protection of our borders."

The statement is very close to those that have been and still are made by Ron Paul and other Libertarians.

The A3P has very clear stance on Immigration the following is right off of their website:

"1 We will deport all illegal and criminal aliens.
2 We will impose massive penalties for employing or assisting them.
3 We will use the U.S. military for border security and build an impenetrable southern fence.
4 We will immediately put an indefinite moratorium on all immigration.
5 We will provide immigrants and their children who have become citizens since 1965 with generous grants to assist their voluntary return to their respective countries of origin.
6 We will also eliminate birthright citizenship, chain migration and asylum."

1 -4 is not anything all that different from most anti-immigration stances. However, 5, 6 are. To be honest here number 5 would affect my parents and it seems like it would be rather costly and confusing. Since there are many children who have one parent that was a citizen and other than was an immigrant. Moreover how would country of origin be proved.

Also, the elimination of birthright citizenship would affect just about every American, other than those that passed a citizen test. I do not know if they mean that very American must pass a citizen test in order to be an American or if this only applies to those that are not white. Bear in mind no distinction is made.

There next stance is on National Defense.

It is just a rehash of their foreign policy. The only difference is this stance "We should, in no way, share our technologies and operational plans with other nations." and an error was made "As President, I will implement these policies and strengthen our national defense." This is the party's website not the candidate. So that is a little slip up on their part.

Moreover America is the biggest arms exporter and I do not know if  technologies applies to arms and armaments.

Now for they last position to quote the A3P:

"Race Issues

A nation’s character is determined by its people – and racial demographics are a primary determinant... we have been undermined by internationalists seeking to destroy the “liberty, sovereignty, and identity” of America.

American values, heritage, and even language are under massive assault and we are quickly degenerating from a predominantly White, Christian nation — which led the world by its positive example — to a third world “tower of Babel”.

This is bizarre and not happening by accident. During the 20th century, socialist global elites hijacked American institutions and media, and began indoctrinating our people into accepting “cultural Marxism” and “political correctness” — complete with multiculturalism, miscegenation, radical feminism and unnatural characterizations.

A3P stands to protect White American interests, since no other political party has shown interest in doing so. This does not make us racist, but protective of our rights – which every other race or group is encouraged and praised for doing. Discriminatory “affirmative action” programs and the invasion of illegal immigrants adversely affect the welfare of all Americans, but especially the White majority.

The goal of A3P is therefore to restore and preserve the legitimacy of White identity, White heritage, and expressions of White interests. We want to stop the divisive, orchestrated destruction of America and restore her to greatness."

For those that have been waiting for the evidence of the A3P being a White Power group there it is. While they do go out of their way to state that they are not  racist, it does fall a little flat.

So there are the American Third Position polices and  positions. On their website they have Position Papers which go into more detail on there views and goals.


Here are some more facts that I am sure the A3P likes to over look. I suppose that they do not like to look at Cracked.com:

Non-citizens born in Mexico but living in America are eight times less likely than male U.S. citizens to be incarcerated. Moreover, American cities that saw the greatest increase in their illegal immigrant populations from 1990 to 2000 also saw the greatest drops in robbery and homicide.